Perhaps the wrong focus?

[zeke5123]

Literally everyone is discussing offense and Tomlin (both good topics).

To me, the biggest culprit was the supposed strength of this team -- the defense. Time and time again, they had a chance to stop the bleeding or give the Steelers a chance to finish the comeback. Time and again, they failed by just getting run on or giving up quick easy passes.

Now some of it was unlucky (e.g., Steelers' tipped pass gets picked; Browns tipped pass falls incomplete). But scheming a still hurt Spillane on the Browns best receiver in a crucial situation? Idiotic. Watt dropping in pass plays without even disguising it (he did generate pressure including generating a holding call)? Moronic. Getting crushed in the run game? Pathetic.

You can't have the supposed strength of the team get so easily destroyed. I posted at BTSC after the Jags game on a film review that Butler continuing to have guys like Vince Williams on well anyone was a recipe for disaster. Well...last night was the culmination of the bed shitting. But it wasn't just last night; had the same issue against the Bengals.

[K_C_]

Literally everyone is discussing offense and Tomlin (both good topics).

To me, the biggest culprit was the supposed strength of this team -- the defense. Time and time again, they had a chance to stop the bleeding or give the Steelers a chance to finish the comeback. Time and again, they failed by just getting run on or giving up quick easy passes.

Now some of it was unlucky (e.g., Steelers' tipped pass gets picked; Browns tipped pass falls incomplete). But scheming a still hurt Spillane on the Browns best receiver in a crucial situation? Idiotic. Watt dropping in pass plays without even disguising it (he did generate pressure including generating a holding call)? Moronic. Getting crushed in the run game? Pathetic.

You can't have the supposed strength of the team get so easily destroyed. I posted at BTSC after the Jags game on a film review that Butler continuing to have guys like Vince Williams on well anyone was a recipe for disaster. Well...last night was the culmination of the bed shitting. But it wasn't just last night; had the same issue against the Bengals.

Chubb didn't play the first time we faced the Browns. I knew last night's wouldn't be a pushover with him back and frankly, I'm not surprised he tore us a new asshole on several occasions. We had far too much trouble stopping the run this year and Chubb is one of the best in the league.

The Steelers shit the bed on both sides of the ball.

[Steelperch]

Bud Dupree was sorely missed. Alex Highsmith was missed. Cassius Marsh was a joke and targeted by the Browns run game. How has the Steelers franchise gotten so bad at running the football?

[Mick]

Our run D has been poor since Bush went out.

Cleveland is really good running, we knew thar was a worrying matchup. Important thing was to avoid early turnovers, because you don’t ever want to fall behind against a team that can run over you. This game was -5 turrnover differential, everything else is white noise.

[zeke5123]

Bud Dupree was sorely missed. Alex Highsmith was missed. Cassius Marsh was a joke and targeted by the Browns run game. How has the Steelers franchise gotten so bad at running the football?

It was weird that kept running out that Marsh fellow instead of Ola.

[zeke5123]

Our run D has been poor since Bush went out.

Cleveland is really good running, we knew thar was a worrying matchup. Important thing was to avoid early turnovers, because you don’t ever want to fall behind against a team that can run over you.

There have been a number of times this year where I was a bit surprised a team stopped running. It was kind of a dirty secret that wasn't exposed often because teams just stopped running.

Losing Dupree did hurt a lot, but I kind of agree that Bush was the bigger loss. I think if we had Bush and Highsmith healthy last night the Run D (and pass D) would've been a lot better.

[steelcountry]

The D was not good, but they're about 4th on the list of problems yesterday. The offense was responsible for about half of the points given up, Mike Tomlin is a mental midget, the game plan in the first half was garbage (even our TD drive was dink and dunk, ball control that took 6 or 7 minutes).

[Havoc]

Bud Dupree was sorely missed. Alex Highsmith was missed. Cassius Marsh was a joke and targeted by the Browns run game. How has the Steelers franchise gotten so bad at running the football?

The combo of Watt + Dupree was a difference maker.

We were playing solid football with those 2 on the field, winning games, looked like a team that would be tough to deal with for opponents in 4th quarters with a savvy vet QB + young up and coming WRs + Watt & Dupree terrorizing offenses.

Our D became more ordinary, our OL went to shit, our young WRs did not progress, our QB looked old.

And, we have zero brains on the offensive side of the football in this organization sans Colbert's drafting and Ben in a 2 minute offense.

[Professor Half Wit]

Bud Dupree was sorely missed. Alex Highsmith was missed. Cassius Marsh was a joke and targeted by the Browns run game. How has the Steelers franchise gotten so bad at running the football?

The combo of Watt + Dupree was a difference maker.

We were playing solid football with those 2 on the field, winning games, looked like a team that would be tough to deal with for opponents in 4th quarters with a savvy vet QB + young up and coming WRs + Watt & Dupree terrorizing offenses.

Our D became more ordinary, our OL went to shit, our young WRs did not progress, our QB looked old.

And, we have zero brains on the offensive side of the football in this organization sans Colbert's drafting and Ben in a 2 minute offense.

I've seen enough to think that you cut all dead and half dead weight to keep DuPree. I move heaven and earth to keep DuPree and one of Sutton or Hilton.

I know it can't happen.

[zeke5123]

The D was not good, but they're about 4th on the list of problems yesterday. The offense was responsible for about half of the points given up, Mike Tomlin is a mental midget, the game plan in the first half was garbage (even our TD drive was dink and dunk, ball control that took 6 or 7 minutes).

I think that is overstating it. The D is supposed to be the strength of this team. It is where the lion share of the draft capital was spent. Each time they came up well short. After Ben's first interception, if you hold the Browns to a FG the game changes. End of the first half if you stop Baker short of the LOS the Steelers go into the half likely with an 18 point deficit but maybe even 14. Not great. But doable. Instead, they give up a freaking TD drive.

They give up two long scoring drives in the 4th when they needed stops.

This is supposed to be the strength of the team.

[Orangesteel]

It’s a great post, and a depressing reminder that we had a short window to take advantage of the fact that we had two premier edge rushers and neither had been given a mega deal. We had an all world defense.

Then injuries happened, teams got smart (as they do, unlike our dumbfuck coaches) and teams started to put up points.

Now, we have to sign Watt to one of the largest defensive contracts maybe ever, Bud will walk and we are going to struggle to keep other key pieces.

It’s depressing as fuck. It’s almost like having two guys that were probably the best best skill position players at their specific position and never doing a fucking thing while they were in the black and gold (Brown and Bell) Oh wait, where have I seen this before?

[zeke5123]

It really is a shame that Dupree and Bush got hurt.

[W&M_Steeler]

It’s a great post, and a depressing reminder that we had a short window to take advantage of the fact that we had two premier edge rushers and neither had been given a mega deal. We had an all world defense.

Then injuries happened, teams got smart (as they do, unlike our dumbfuck coaches) and teams started to put up points.

Now, we have to sign Watt to one of the largest defensive contracts maybe ever, Bud will walk and we are going to struggle to keep other key pieces.

It’s depressing as fuck. It’s almost like having two guys that were probably the best best skill position players at their specific position and never doing a fucking thing while they were in the black and gold (Brown and Bell) Oh wait, where have I seen this before?

I'm starting to think that it doesn't make sense to try to have a world class defense. The rules at this point are completely tilted to favor the offense. In order to have a world class defense, you need to have stars at multiple positions. That requires a great deal of money and draft capital. Then, because of the way the rules are tilted, an injury to one of two of those stars means your world class defense is no longer world class. A merely very good defense is not enough to win if your offense isn't also very good (harder to accomplish when you have so many resources tied up in your defense), and injuries are inevitable. Lose Bush and Bud and the defense is no longer good enough to win.

I think the focus needs to be on offense, with the defense being good but not world class, one that can stop the run and generate turnovers, with players as essentially interchangeable parts with no one getting mega contracts. Maybe I'm nuts, but I am somewhat unenthusiastic about paying Watt mega money. I'd rather spend that money rebuilding the O-line (assuming, of course, we could get competent offensive coaching).

[zeke5123]

It’s a great post, and a depressing reminder that we had a short window to take advantage of the fact that we had two premier edge rushers and neither had been given a mega deal. We had an all world defense.

Then injuries happened, teams got smart (as they do, unlike our dumbfuck coaches) and teams started to put up points.

Now, we have to sign Watt to one of the largest defensive contracts maybe ever, Bud will walk and we are going to struggle to keep other key pieces.

It’s depressing as fuck. It’s almost like having two guys that were probably the best best skill position players at their specific position and never doing a fucking thing while they were in the black and gold (Brown and Bell) Oh wait, where have I seen this before?

I'm starting to think that it doesn't make sense to try to have a world class defense. The rules at this point are completely tilted to favor the offense. In order to have a world class defense, you need to have stars at multiple positions. That requires a great deal of money and draft capital. Then, because of the way the rules are tilted, an injury to one of two of those stars means your world class defense is no longer world class. A merely very good defense is not enough to win if your offense isn't also very good (harder to accomplish when you have so many resources tied up in your defense), and injuries are inevitable. Lose Bush and Bud and the defense is no longer good enough to win.

I think the focus needs to be on offense, with the defense being good but not world class, one that can stop the run and generate turnovers, with players as essentially interchangeable parts with no one getting mega contracts. Maybe I'm nuts, but I am somewhat unenthusiastic about paying Watt mega money. I'd rather spend that money rebuilding the O-line (assuming, of course, we could get competent offensive coaching).

All the more if they won't call holding

[steelcountry]

It’s a great post, and a depressing reminder that we had a short window to take advantage of the fact that we had two premier edge rushers and neither had been given a mega deal. We had an all world defense.

Then injuries happened, teams got smart (as they do, unlike our dumbfuck coaches) and teams started to put up points.

Now, we have to sign Watt to one of the largest defensive contracts maybe ever, Bud will walk and we are going to struggle to keep other key pieces.

It’s depressing as fuck. It’s almost like having two guys that were probably the best best skill position players at their specific position and never doing a fucking thing while they were in the black and gold (Brown and Bell) Oh wait, where have I seen this before?

I'm starting to think that it doesn't make sense to try to have a world class defense. The rules at this point are completely tilted to favor the offense. In order to have a world class defense, you need to have stars at multiple positions. That requires a great deal of money and draft capital. Then, because of the way the rules are tilted, an injury to one of two of those stars means your world class defense is no longer world class. A merely very good defense is not enough to win if your offense isn't also very good (harder to accomplish when you have so many resources tied up in your defense), and injuries are inevitable. Lose Bush and Bud and the defense is no longer good enough to win.

I think the focus needs to be on offense, with the defense being good but not world class, one that can stop the run and generate turnovers, with players as essentially interchangeable parts with no one getting mega contracts. Maybe I'm nuts, but I am somewhat unenthusiastic about paying Watt mega money. I'd rather spend that money rebuilding the O-line (assuming, of course, we could get competent offensive coaching).

All the more if they won't call holding

On the flip side, if OL are allowed to hold more then you don't need to invest money and draft capital in it as much. If anything, the more OL are allowed to hold the more you need guys like Watt.

The team should just prioritize positions that can be difference makers - QB, pass rush, CBs with ball skills.

[W&M_Steeler]

I'm starting to think that it doesn't make sense to try to have a world class defense. The rules at this point are completely tilted to favor the offense. In order to have a world class defense, you need to have stars at multiple positions. That requires a great deal of money and draft capital. Then, because of the way the rules are tilted, an injury to one of two of those stars means your world class defense is no longer world class. A merely very good defense is not enough to win if your offense isn't also very good (harder to accomplish when you have so many resources tied up in your defense), and injuries are inevitable. Lose Bush and Bud and the defense is no longer good enough to win.

I think the focus needs to be on offense, with the defense being good but not world class, one that can stop the run and generate turnovers, with players as essentially interchangeable parts with no one getting mega contracts. Maybe I'm nuts, but I am somewhat unenthusiastic about paying Watt mega money. I'd rather spend that money rebuilding the O-line (assuming, of course, we could get competent offensive coaching).

All the more if they won't call holding

On the flip side, if OL are allowed to hold more then you don't need to invest money and draft capital in it as much. If anything, the more OL are allowed to hold the more you need guys like Watt.

The team should just prioritize positions that can be difference makers - QB, pass rush, CBs with ball skills.

You still need to have an O-line that can drive the defensive line off the ball and get a yard when you need it. Our current line can't, holding or no. You also need a RB who can find creases, pass block, catch dump-offs and swing passes and make something happen in space, and who doesn't go down on first contact all the time. You also need a TE or two who can both catch and block (and who isn't a headcase or dipshit). I'd rather try to fix those things than pay quarterback money to a linebacker.

[sinceiwas4]

thing is, and i have said it many times, Tomlin can not win it all without a Championship Defense. he just can't. he proved that when he had one of the greatest offensive talent groups going and shut them down to try and hold 1 score leads sometimes in the 3rd! he was hired because he wanted to coach attrition football. (go back and watch his hiring interviews) and thats what he coaches. thus thread is right, that ut may not be the best way to win anymore because fantasy tv big offense nfl wants scori g and big plays, but its our only option with Tomlin and he was hired to do just that so there's no reason to believe team wouldnt go hire another young DC to replace him that also wants attrition football. good thing is if theres a silver loning its that the pendulum is always swinging and regardless of what nfl wants to put on tv, coaches want to win and good defense and run games will be back once defenses switch to fast smaller teams to stop the passing game...and i think its already starting to happen.
so anyway after that longwinded ramble the tldr is i say build the Defense as priority always while we have Tomlin and unless Rooneys alter their mindset it will always be so. but that will lead to cyclical success as nfl pendulum swings.

[steelcountry]

All the more if they won't call holding

On the flip side, if OL are allowed to hold more then you don't need to invest money and draft capital in it as much. If anything, the more OL are allowed to hold the more you need guys like Watt.

The team should just prioritize positions that can be difference makers - QB, pass rush, CBs with ball skills.

You still need to have an O-line that can drive the defensive line off the ball and get a yard when you need it. Our current line can't, holding or no. You also need a RB who can find creases, pass block, catch dump-offs and swing passes and make something happen in space, and who doesn't go down on first contact all the time. You also need a TE or two who can both catch and block (and who isn't a headcase or dipshit). I'd rather try to fix those things than pay quarterback money to a linebacker.

A lot to unpack here:

You can extend your comments to positions on defense. You need players that can get off blocks, you need players that can stick to WRs, you need guys who can run with TEs and not get outmatched physically.

You conveniently call Watt 'a linebacker' as if he's not be the best edge player in the game. If Watt gets ~28M a season, that is hardly 'very good QB' money. The top guys are already starting to get 40M a season.

When did our D fall off a cliff? When we lost our 2nd best edge player. Pass rush is the 2nd most important position behind QB. You pay those guys before you invest in RB, IOL. RB and IOL are two of the easiest positions to replace.

[W&M_Steeler]

On the flip side, if OL are allowed to hold more then you don't need to invest money and draft capital in it as much. If anything, the more OL are allowed to hold the more you need guys like Watt.

The team should just prioritize positions that can be difference makers - QB, pass rush, CBs with ball skills.

You still need to have an O-line that can drive the defensive line off the ball and get a yard when you need it. Our current line can't, holding or no. You also need a RB who can find creases, pass block, catch dump-offs and swing passes and make something happen in space, and who doesn't go down on first contact all the time. You also need a TE or two who can both catch and block (and who isn't a headcase or dipshit). I'd rather try to fix those things than pay quarterback money to a linebacker.

A lot to unpack here:

You can extend your comments to positions on defense. You need players that can get off blocks, you need players that can stick to WRs, you need guys who can run with TEs and not get outmatched physically.

You conveniently call Watt 'a linebacker' as if he's not be the best edge player in the game. If Watt gets ~28M a season, that is hardly 'very good QB' money. The top guys are already starting to get 40M a season.

When did our D fall off a cliff? When we lost our 2nd best edge player. Pass rush is the 2nd most important position behind QB. You pay those guys before you invest in RB, IOL. RB and IOL are two of the easiest positions to replace.

I didn't know why you quoted "very good quarterback" money, as I didn't write that. I wrote "quarterback" money. Bottom line, I don't think that defense wins championships anymore, and I think putting that kind of money into a line backer, even if he is an "edge rusher" is not a smart move. It would cripple the offense, especially if they'd also break the bank to keep Dupree. Elite edge rushers are a luxury. Khalil Mack isn't winning a Super Bowl anytime soon. Sinking $40 million / year into two edge rushers to the detriment of the rest of the team would be a mistake, particularly when they aren't nearly as effective on their own if one of the two goes down with an injury (which is more likely to happen to a defensive player than a QB). Do you really want to give Watt $28 million / year based on what you saw of him in the games after Dupree went down? And do you really want to devote $40 million a year to edge rush?

If RB is so easy to replace and so inconsequential, and IOL so unimportant, then why haven't we had a decent running game in three years? The offense was so one-dimensional this year that I don't think the Steelers would have won a Super Bowl even with Dupree and Bush healthy. This is an offense league. Fix the offense.

[955876]

How has the Steelers franchise gotten so bad at running the football?

Lack of attention to detail as well as a lack of reps at practice.

This team isn’t crisp.

That speaks to practice.

Plus many of the players are just not very good.

[SteelerDayTrader]

Run game is bad for several reasons

The OL sucks
The OL coach sucks
The Steelers put contract $$$ status ahead of performance in determining who starts
The RBs with the exception of Connor suck
Connor is often injured
The OC sucks
The play design sucks
The play calling sucks

Very hard to get far when you are that bad on several levels and your offense becomes a one dimensional pass offense with no run game threat

[steelcountry]

You still need to have an O-line that can drive the defensive line off the ball and get a yard when you need it. Our current line can't, holding or no. You also need a RB who can find creases, pass block, catch dump-offs and swing passes and make something happen in space, and who doesn't go down on first contact all the time. You also need a TE or two who can both catch and block (and who isn't a headcase or dipshit). I'd rather try to fix those things than pay quarterback money to a linebacker.

A lot to unpack here:

You can extend your comments to positions on defense. You need players that can get off blocks, you need players that can stick to WRs, you need guys who can run with TEs and not get outmatched physically.

You conveniently call Watt 'a linebacker' as if he's not be the best edge player in the game. If Watt gets ~28M a season, that is hardly 'very good QB' money. The top guys are already starting to get 40M a season.

When did our D fall off a cliff? When we lost our 2nd best edge player. Pass rush is the 2nd most important position behind QB. You pay those guys before you invest in RB, IOL. RB and IOL are two of the easiest positions to replace.

I didn't know why you quoted "very good quarterback" money, as I didn't write that. I wrote "quarterback" money. Bottom line, I don't think that defense wins championships anymore, and I think putting that kind of money into a line backer, even if he is an "edge rusher" is not a smart move. It would cripple the offense, especially if they'd also break the bank to keep Dupree. Elite edge rushers are a luxury. Khalil Mack isn't winning a Super Bowl anytime soon. Sinking $40 million / year into two edge rushers to the detriment of the rest of the team would be a mistake, particularly when they aren't nearly as effective on their own if one of the two goes down with an injury (which is more likely to happen to a defensive player than a QB). Do you really want to give Watt $28 million / year based on what you saw of him in the games after Dupree went down? And do you really want to devote $40 million a year to edge rush?

If RB is so easy to replace and so inconsequential, and IOL so unimportant, then why haven't we had a decent running game in three years? The offense was so one-dimensional this year that I don't think the Steelers would have won a Super Bowl even with Dupree and Bush healthy. This is an offense league. Fix the offense.

It wasn't meant to imply you said it, just that it was a term I wanted to make clear.

I can literally apply all of your comments regarding D to RB and OL. I haven't seen Zeke Elliott, Christian McCaffrey, Dalvin Cook sniff a chance at a Super Bowl. I haven't seen Scherff, Zack Martin, Andrew Norwell sniff a chance either. These are all guys regarded as among the best at their position.

Have you seen Watt's stat line since Dupree went down? In 5 games he had 4 sacks, 2 FFs, 7 TFL, 2 PD. He was still really good.

The reason we haven't had a good run gaming is because we're spending way too much money into declining OL (along with stale game plan). That money hasn't allowed us to spend money at more important positions. IOL should be a position group that you invest a mid round pick in most years, which will allow you to spend more important resources on QB, pass rush, OT.

You fix the offense by purging the overpaid fat on the OL and TE, playing your best guys (Dotson), hit on a relatively cheap vet (Banner) and invest a premium pick in OT and a mid round pick in IOL. You don't spend premium picks or money on IOL and RB.

[sinceiwas4]

"I don't think the Steelers would have won a Super Bowl even with Dupree and Bush healthy."

you make alot of good points and i understand your argument against putting all your money in a few players that if hurt you can't win without, but IF they stay healthy, you can and in this case i believe would've won it all. risk/reward you're saying the risk is too high and you may be right but the reward IS another title.
that Defense was top in stats acrossed the board even having lost one of them. it wasn't until losing both defensive right side linebackers AND one of their backups that it wasn't enough anymore.
and with the other one's backup going down in playoff game it was definitely over for sure if highsmith couldn't have comeback for bills, marsh wasnt enuff by a mile

[pickarooney]

Bud Dupree was sorely missed. Alex Highsmith was missed. Cassius Marsh was a joke and targeted by the Browns run game. How has the Steelers franchise gotten so bad at running the football?

The combo of Watt + Dupree was a difference maker.

We were playing solid football with those 2 on the field, winning games, looked like a team that would be tough to deal with for opponents in 4th quarters with a savvy vet QB + young up and coming WRs + Watt & Dupree terrorizing offenses.

Our D became more ordinary, our OL went to shit, our young WRs did not progress, our QB looked old.

And, we have zero brains on the offensive side of the football in this organization sans Colbert's drafting and Ben in a 2 minute offense.

I've seen enough to think that you cut all dead and half dead weight to keep DuPree. I move heaven and earth to keep DuPree and one of Sutton or Hilton.

I know it can't happen.

This is how my thinking shifted post-game as well. Previously, I was for letting Bud go. Now I'd prefer jettisoning a lot of other guys and making him a legit offer.

[Jobu]

The combo of Watt + Dupree was a difference maker.

We were playing solid football with those 2 on the field, winning games, looked like a team that would be tough to deal with for opponents in 4th quarters with a savvy vet QB + young up and coming WRs + Watt & Dupree terrorizing offenses.

Our D became more ordinary, our OL went to shit, our young WRs did not progress, our QB looked old.

And, we have zero brains on the offensive side of the football in this organization sans Colbert's drafting and Ben in a 2 minute offense.

I've seen enough to think that you cut all dead and half dead weight to keep DuPree. I move heaven and earth to keep DuPree and one of Sutton or Hilton.

I know it can't happen.

This is how my thinking shifted post-game as well. Previously, I was for letting Bud go. Now I'd prefer jettisoning a lot of other guys and making him a legit offer.

Why though? Let’s stop kidding ourselves, this team is not championship caliber... probably hasn’t been for awhile.
There is going to be a lot of turnover, including the QB spot.
We are looking at a 3-4 year (if you’re lucky) rebuild, including hopefully finding your next championship caliber QB. So you throw big money at Dupree and by the time you’re even close to competing again, hes 32-33years old on an expiring contract with a big cap hit. You’ve won nothing in the meantime.
IMO, the smart move is to commit to a makeover, recognize 3-4 young guys on each side of the ball and build around them. Bud Dupree isn’t one of those guys.

[Professor Half Wit]

I've seen enough to think that you cut all dead and half dead weight to keep DuPree. I move heaven and earth to keep DuPree and one of Sutton or Hilton.

I know it can't happen.

This is how my thinking shifted post-game as well. Previously, I was for letting Bud go. Now I'd prefer jettisoning a lot of other guys and making him a legit offer.

Why though? Let’s stop kidding ourselves, this team is not championship caliber... probably hasn’t been for awhile.
There is going to be a lot of turnover, including the QB spot.
We are looking at a 3-4 year (if you’re lucky) rebuild, including hopefully finding your next championship caliber QB. So you throw big money at Dupree and by the time you’re even close to competing again, hes 32-33years old on an expiring contract with a big cap hit. You’ve won nothing in the meantime.
IMO, the smart move is to commit to a makeover, recognize 3-4 young guys on each side of the ball and build around them. Bud Dupree isn’t one of those guys.

Because I love defense and would enjoy watching Watt and Dupree Hulk smash QBs even while the Steelers lose. This is not sarcasm.

[Jobu]

This is how my thinking shifted post-game as well. Previously, I was for letting Bud go. Now I'd prefer jettisoning a lot of other guys and making him a legit offer.

Why though? Let’s stop kidding ourselves, this team is not championship caliber... probably hasn’t been for awhile.
There is going to be a lot of turnover, including the QB spot.
We are looking at a 3-4 year (if you’re lucky) rebuild, including hopefully finding your next championship caliber QB. So you throw big money at Dupree and by the time you’re even close to competing again, hes 32-33years old on an expiring contract with a big cap hit. You’ve won nothing in the meantime.
IMO, the smart move is to commit to a makeover, recognize 3-4 young guys on each side of the ball and build around them. Bud Dupree isn’t one of those guys.

Because I love defense and would enjoy watching Watt and Dupree Hulk smash QBs even while the Steelers lose. This is not sarcasm.

Well, I can’t argue with that.

[stillthere]

I'm starting to think that it doesn't make sense to try to have a world class defense. The rules at this point are completely tilted to favor the offense. In order to have a world class defense, you need to have stars at multiple positions. That requires a great deal of money and draft capital. Then, because of the way the rules are tilted, an injury to one of two of those stars means your world class defense is no longer world class. A merely very good defense is not enough to win if your offense isn't also very good (harder to accomplish when you have so many resources tied up in your defense), and injuries are inevitable. Lose Bush and Bud and the defense is no longer good enough to win.

I think the focus needs to be on offense, with the defense being good but not world class, one that can stop the run and generate turnovers, with players as essentially interchangeable parts with no one getting mega contracts. Maybe I'm nuts, but I am somewhat unenthusiastic about paying Watt mega money. I'd rather spend that money rebuilding the O-line (assuming, of course, we could get competent offensive coaching).

They were also down Highsmith, had a shell with Spillane and a guy still learning on the fly in Williamson, If they had a healthy Highsmith the rush D is better maybe not dominant but probably does better against Chubb and Hunt. Marsh was not good reminded me of Chikilo.

The whole scheme Spillane to be forced to cover Jarvis Landry at this point is hubris or stupidity and neither one of those things belong on the staff. Not like it has not been happening for about 3 years at least. Is it they don't know how to counter those formations or that they just don't want to show and declare before the snap?

This loss feels like it falls 30 percent on coaching, 30 percent on the O, 30 percent on the D, and 10 percent on just plain the football bounces weird (ball dies as Ben and Conner are chasing it down with like a 4 yard lead on the nearest Cleveland defender and the punt that looked like it was going to stick inside the 5 and just goes a yard too far a little quicker than we needed it to.

[stillthere]

All the more if they won't call holding

Ain't that the truth. Just makes the guys that can get home while being held worth that much more money.

[COR-TEN]

This loss feels like it falls 30 percent on coaching, 30 percent on the O, 30 percent on the D, and 10 percent on just plain the football bounces weird (ball dies as Ben and Conner are chasing it down with like a 4 yard lead on the nearest Cleveland defender and the punt that looked like it was going to stick inside the 5 and just goes a yard too far a little quicker than we needed it to.

I can agree with this. I stopped watching after the stains scored the TD making it 35 to what could have been a surmountable lead.

Watching them get their asses handed to them was too much to bear.

Everybody sucked donkey dick. Everybody.